Post by Admin on May 22, 2020 18:47:04 GMT -7
Edgars History of Dumfries
By David Crosby June 13, 2002 at 11:31:34
In reply to: Crosby, a Sept of Clan Bruce
12/28/01
Edgar's History of Dumfries -1746
Edited by R.C. Reid, only 350 copies printed by J. Maxwell & Sons -1915
Scot H2 11
Wrote about the Crosbies he knew, The Charles H Herries Genealogical Charts are appended. The information ties Crosbj [Note 62a] To the Crosbies of Oulcottis, Holm, Kip, The Corsbies [yes, Corsbie] of Dumfries, John Crosby the Bishop of Ardfart and founder of the Irish Branch, etc.
Edgar Served as Deacon of Trades and Dean of Trades, working with and for masons, carpenters, etc. He was a man of the people, and resented authority. Much of his history is spent criticizing those in authority in the city. The spelling has been preserved as written.
Parts of pages mentioning Crosbie are copied to share Edgar's historical flavor. I have capitalized CROSBY [what ever the spelling] to make it more visible, as I also did with the word FOUNDER or other indication of missing information. The important parts for us are NOTE 62a and Appendix D
Page 64 "... increase they increase who eat them, and they were ever free of fruit who never had an orchard.These advances tend to ruin many families in the place, who are neither able to pay to the Town's Excise nor the King's, nor their proportions of Stent for their poor occupations, as Taylor's, Weavers, Shoe- makers whose plenishing and utensils are poynded & distrained every six weeks, and for ought I know, says mine Author, sold at half value, which ought to open the eyes of the Administrators & faction to consider the oppression of the poor who want bread.There was once an offer or overture by a well designing honest Provost when he was elected (CROSBY), that if the Bailiffs would with him, he would renounce the Provost's salary due to him and service gratis; but he was so browbeat by those in the Council who had enjoy'd the salary for many years, that he was afterwards, Consonans muta, non vocalis.[Note55]It is said that within these 35 years past,the Administrators recommended some of their poor friends to be Greeves or Overseers to the Town's work' which was formerly attended by one of the Bailifs in their turns and Dean& Treasurer, but now to a great salary yearly, and one as a street cleanser named scavenger who gets the Compost & for a Salary.But the Administrators being all inexperienced & abandoning former managements, will do what they incline,and Counsellors will not resist the Magistrates, whereas if former reasonable orders were observed, serious orders by their authority would be obey'd vizt. that all persons, When the streets are made nasty by the Inhabitants bringing in hay, peats, or other things about their possessions and taking out dunghills & rubbish, be ordered to sweep and carry off the said rubbish & dung and make the streets clean opposite their possessions, and carry them to the places of their compost;which I have seen done, says mine Author, while one of the Bailifs was upbraided by a foul mouthed husife, and she escaped without punishment, he wanting courage and authority to inflict it, naming him publickly a scavenger."
Page 66" ... In Anno 1704 the faction prevalent in the Council elected mercenarily a Writer (this F. .L.) to be Town Clerk,[Note 62]against which choice they were warned in a printed letter, because of his fraudulent purposes against the properties of ye Inhabitants and keeping the Town's records to serve his purposes. In which case they gave the wolf the wedder to keep, which proved eventually true.The printed paper above mentioned I shall here insert verbatim which is as follows.
[No copy of the pamphlet seems to have survived]
Page 67 "But notwithstanding of this warning, the Administrators gave way for this man's admission to the Clerkship, as they did afterwards for his acceptation of a Substitution from the Sheriff Depute of the Shire, as before noticed.And he their servant became their master (because they would not put on their spectacles to see) & hufft them publicly saying he was Sheriff & so above them; the Administrators being divided,and the imposing servant having the major part of the Council on his side, were forced to succumb, & so this Hector behaved ‘till the year after the Union, when Justice Aires were revived, of which he had good reason to be afraid, having past many unjust sentences for money, both as Town Clerk & Sheriff Substitute & so demitted. His strenuous friends in his defence,& who elected him (tho' he injured the best of them in their honour & purse), were Provost CROSBY [Note62a]B. Gilchrist, B. Ewart, B. Corrie, B. Paterson, A. Bell, J. Bishop. B. Kennan, but above all the amphibious Provost, who gave the casting vote for a five guinea piece, which for his friends sake H-m he durst not refuse.
62a
-The Family of CROSBIE can lay claim to a Norman descent.In the Lyon Office there is a copy of a printed pedigree compiled by Capt.Howard Herries-CROSBIE, Resident Magistrate in Donegal.He traces the descent from Sir John de CROSEBI, a man of Norse origin, whose ancestors settled in Normandy with Rollo, at a place named Corbic in Picardy. The name was then spelt CROSBJ.
Coming to England with the Conqueror, he was granted lands at the mouth of the Mersey, which he called CROSBIE after himself. He had four sons; Simon, FROM WHOM the Lancashire Family were descended; Robert, FOUNDER of the Cumberland Family; Adam, and Thomas, FOUNDER of the Berwickshire CROSBYS. Adam is said to have received a grant (unrecorded) of LANDS IN ANNANDALE, and to have had three children, Ivo, Richard, and Euphernia (Bain's Cal. i. 197).Euphemia married Robert de Brus, 2nd Lord of Annandale. Ivo is said to have married a natural daughter of Robert deBrus, 1st Lord of Annandale. His son, Adam de CROSSBI, is mentioned in an escambion of land in Cummertrees (Bain, i. I685). He married Matilda de Hereis, and left three sons, Robert de CROSSEBI, born circa 1187, Ivo, and Ricardo, both of whom witnessed a Brus charter of land in Drysdale (Bain, i. p. 635).Robert seems to have been a man of prominence, as there are many references to him in charters of the period.He married Juone de Dinwidi, and left a son, Robert, who received a Brus grant of commonty in the wood of Stapleton.
This Robert was succeeded by another Robert de CROSSBI, the husband of Ada, sister of Edno de Carliol. They had two sons, Robert, and John, a cleric, who was presented to the church of St, Mary in the Forest, 1298 (Bain, ii. No 1008).
Robert, the elder brother, married Maud de Kirkpatrick, by whom he had seven sons, all of whom fought, and five of whom were killed, at Bannockburn.He helped to despatch John Cumin in the Greyfriars Church, Dumfries, and died in 1314. His eldest son, Adam, fought on the English side at Bannockburn, and was killed by his father.Robert, the second son, born circa 1290, succeeded his father. He fought under Edward Brus in Ireland.On 24 July, 1347, he served on an inquest at Lochmaben (Bain, iii. No. 1499),It is stated that he was granted land by Robert de Brus, and died about 1360.
Whatever may be the derivation of the name, Stodart has pointed out (Scottish Arms) that in the Shires of Ayr, Kirkcudbright, and Berwick, are places called CROSBIE or CORSBIE, from which the name may have been taken.Robert de CROSSEBI, of Oulcottes, born circa I339, and son of the above, was succeeded in the property by his son Richard, and grandson Robert, the latter of whom, dying in 1498, left two sons and a daughter.For the later genealogy of the family see Appendix D."
Appendix A Page 251
"NO. 45.-Edinburgh, 16 Dec. 1686.Forasmuch as the Kings most exellent Majestic by a letter direct under the Royal hand dated at Whitehall the 26th day of November last bypast, to the Privy Councill of this his ancient Kingdome, Resolved that the persons underwritten should be nominat and appointed Magistrats and other Councillors for the Burgh of Dumfreise, as being such whom hisMajestie judges most loyall and ready to promote his Royall Service and most forward to support the good and interest of the said Burgh.Therefore, the Lords of his Majesties Privy Councill inpursuance of his Majesties commands aforesaid Do hereby nominat
and appoint John Maxwell of Barncleugh to be Provost of the said Burgh of Dumfreise, John Irving, son to the deceased John Irving lait Provost there, to be baillie in place of baillie Fingass deceased, John Rome present baillie, and John Irving, present baillie, to continue bailies; John CORSBIE present Deacon of the Trades to be Conveiner, and the four new merchant councillors which are yearly elected with the Dean Treasurer and the rest of the Deacons of Trades, to be elected by the advice of the Magistrats aforesaid, All which persons are hereby authorised to continue in thair respective offices in the said Burgh and Liberties thereof untill Michallmasse nixt ensueing the date of these presents.And the saids Lords ordains the persons above named to meet at the Toun Councill House of the said Burgh of Dumfreise, upon the 11th day of January nixt, and there to enter to thair respective offices, according as is prescribedby his Majesties letter:And this present Act is extracted forth of the Records of the Privy Councill by me Sir William Patersone Knight, Clerk to his Majesties Privy Councill.
(Original in Burgh Charter Chest)."
Appendix D
CROSBIE OF OULCOTTIS AND HOLM
Robert Crosbie of Oulcottis 1415-98 son of Richard of Oulcottis
Robert had three children: Andrew 1433 d. by 1498,
Steven 1435 outlawed with Andrew [A.D.C. 420]
and Janet 1437 m. 1st Lord Carlisle as 2nd wife
Andrew's son = Robert Crosbie of Oulcottis b. 1481 succeeded his grandfather in 1498. In 1502 he sold the lands of Sark to Andrew Chalmer. In 1516 he sold Oucottis to William Lord Carlisle [Scots Peerage II 385.] m. Elizabeth dau. Of William 2nd Lord Carlisle.
Robert had two sons; Robert Crosbie 1513 d.s.p. 1563
and John Crosbie 1518 merchant bailie of Dumfries 1543. d. circa 1582. He is the FOUNDER of the Dumfries Branch of the family. m. Janet, sister of Provost Roger McBrair
John had two sons; Robert Crosbie 1550 m. Sophia Gledstanis
and John Crosbie, clerk in Holy Orders, Bishop in 1600 d. 1621 FOUNDER of the Irish Branch. Issue
Robert had five children; John Crosbie b. 1573 in Kelwod m. Agnes Dalrymple,
David Crosbie 1608 [merchant in Dumfries, Grandfather of William Crosbie, deacon coveener d.s.p. m. Maria Swan], two daughters, and Andrew Crosbie 1620 d. Aug 1674 m. Elizabeth Corrie dau. Of William Corrie. 2nd m. Helen Newall, d. 1675
Andrew had three children; John Crosbie 1650-1720, Provost of Dumfries, purchased Holm of Dalscairth in 1708 1st m Margaret dau. Of Robert Herries of Burnbarroch mother of Andrew Crosbie of Holm, 2nd m 4 Feb 1691 Janet dau. Of James Kennan bailie of Dumfries mother of Mary. Andrew's 2nd child a daughter named Agnes, and third, a son Andrew Crosbie, younger 1674, merchant, tenant of Thomas Gledstanis [R.P.C. II, 3rd, ser. 615]
From here on the chart becomes cluttered and hard to type out without drawing a bunch of connecting lines, so I have prepared a Gedcom file for anyone that wants it.
The recorded Crosby Family Shield was a gold cross on a red shield
The recorded Corsby Family Shield was a red cross on a gold shield
By David Crosby June 13, 2002 at 11:31:34
In reply to: Crosby, a Sept of Clan Bruce
12/28/01
Edgar's History of Dumfries -1746
Edited by R.C. Reid, only 350 copies printed by J. Maxwell & Sons -1915
Scot H2 11
Wrote about the Crosbies he knew, The Charles H Herries Genealogical Charts are appended. The information ties Crosbj [Note 62a] To the Crosbies of Oulcottis, Holm, Kip, The Corsbies [yes, Corsbie] of Dumfries, John Crosby the Bishop of Ardfart and founder of the Irish Branch, etc.
Edgar Served as Deacon of Trades and Dean of Trades, working with and for masons, carpenters, etc. He was a man of the people, and resented authority. Much of his history is spent criticizing those in authority in the city. The spelling has been preserved as written.
Parts of pages mentioning Crosbie are copied to share Edgar's historical flavor. I have capitalized CROSBY [what ever the spelling] to make it more visible, as I also did with the word FOUNDER or other indication of missing information. The important parts for us are NOTE 62a and Appendix D
Page 64 "... increase they increase who eat them, and they were ever free of fruit who never had an orchard.These advances tend to ruin many families in the place, who are neither able to pay to the Town's Excise nor the King's, nor their proportions of Stent for their poor occupations, as Taylor's, Weavers, Shoe- makers whose plenishing and utensils are poynded & distrained every six weeks, and for ought I know, says mine Author, sold at half value, which ought to open the eyes of the Administrators & faction to consider the oppression of the poor who want bread.There was once an offer or overture by a well designing honest Provost when he was elected (CROSBY), that if the Bailiffs would with him, he would renounce the Provost's salary due to him and service gratis; but he was so browbeat by those in the Council who had enjoy'd the salary for many years, that he was afterwards, Consonans muta, non vocalis.[Note55]It is said that within these 35 years past,the Administrators recommended some of their poor friends to be Greeves or Overseers to the Town's work' which was formerly attended by one of the Bailifs in their turns and Dean& Treasurer, but now to a great salary yearly, and one as a street cleanser named scavenger who gets the Compost & for a Salary.But the Administrators being all inexperienced & abandoning former managements, will do what they incline,and Counsellors will not resist the Magistrates, whereas if former reasonable orders were observed, serious orders by their authority would be obey'd vizt. that all persons, When the streets are made nasty by the Inhabitants bringing in hay, peats, or other things about their possessions and taking out dunghills & rubbish, be ordered to sweep and carry off the said rubbish & dung and make the streets clean opposite their possessions, and carry them to the places of their compost;which I have seen done, says mine Author, while one of the Bailifs was upbraided by a foul mouthed husife, and she escaped without punishment, he wanting courage and authority to inflict it, naming him publickly a scavenger."
Page 66" ... In Anno 1704 the faction prevalent in the Council elected mercenarily a Writer (this F. .L.) to be Town Clerk,[Note 62]against which choice they were warned in a printed letter, because of his fraudulent purposes against the properties of ye Inhabitants and keeping the Town's records to serve his purposes. In which case they gave the wolf the wedder to keep, which proved eventually true.The printed paper above mentioned I shall here insert verbatim which is as follows.
[No copy of the pamphlet seems to have survived]
Page 67 "But notwithstanding of this warning, the Administrators gave way for this man's admission to the Clerkship, as they did afterwards for his acceptation of a Substitution from the Sheriff Depute of the Shire, as before noticed.And he their servant became their master (because they would not put on their spectacles to see) & hufft them publicly saying he was Sheriff & so above them; the Administrators being divided,and the imposing servant having the major part of the Council on his side, were forced to succumb, & so this Hector behaved ‘till the year after the Union, when Justice Aires were revived, of which he had good reason to be afraid, having past many unjust sentences for money, both as Town Clerk & Sheriff Substitute & so demitted. His strenuous friends in his defence,& who elected him (tho' he injured the best of them in their honour & purse), were Provost CROSBY [Note62a]B. Gilchrist, B. Ewart, B. Corrie, B. Paterson, A. Bell, J. Bishop. B. Kennan, but above all the amphibious Provost, who gave the casting vote for a five guinea piece, which for his friends sake H-m he durst not refuse.
62a
-The Family of CROSBIE can lay claim to a Norman descent.In the Lyon Office there is a copy of a printed pedigree compiled by Capt.Howard Herries-CROSBIE, Resident Magistrate in Donegal.He traces the descent from Sir John de CROSEBI, a man of Norse origin, whose ancestors settled in Normandy with Rollo, at a place named Corbic in Picardy. The name was then spelt CROSBJ.
Coming to England with the Conqueror, he was granted lands at the mouth of the Mersey, which he called CROSBIE after himself. He had four sons; Simon, FROM WHOM the Lancashire Family were descended; Robert, FOUNDER of the Cumberland Family; Adam, and Thomas, FOUNDER of the Berwickshire CROSBYS. Adam is said to have received a grant (unrecorded) of LANDS IN ANNANDALE, and to have had three children, Ivo, Richard, and Euphernia (Bain's Cal. i. 197).Euphemia married Robert de Brus, 2nd Lord of Annandale. Ivo is said to have married a natural daughter of Robert deBrus, 1st Lord of Annandale. His son, Adam de CROSSBI, is mentioned in an escambion of land in Cummertrees (Bain, i. I685). He married Matilda de Hereis, and left three sons, Robert de CROSSEBI, born circa 1187, Ivo, and Ricardo, both of whom witnessed a Brus charter of land in Drysdale (Bain, i. p. 635).Robert seems to have been a man of prominence, as there are many references to him in charters of the period.He married Juone de Dinwidi, and left a son, Robert, who received a Brus grant of commonty in the wood of Stapleton.
This Robert was succeeded by another Robert de CROSSBI, the husband of Ada, sister of Edno de Carliol. They had two sons, Robert, and John, a cleric, who was presented to the church of St, Mary in the Forest, 1298 (Bain, ii. No 1008).
Robert, the elder brother, married Maud de Kirkpatrick, by whom he had seven sons, all of whom fought, and five of whom were killed, at Bannockburn.He helped to despatch John Cumin in the Greyfriars Church, Dumfries, and died in 1314. His eldest son, Adam, fought on the English side at Bannockburn, and was killed by his father.Robert, the second son, born circa 1290, succeeded his father. He fought under Edward Brus in Ireland.On 24 July, 1347, he served on an inquest at Lochmaben (Bain, iii. No. 1499),It is stated that he was granted land by Robert de Brus, and died about 1360.
Whatever may be the derivation of the name, Stodart has pointed out (Scottish Arms) that in the Shires of Ayr, Kirkcudbright, and Berwick, are places called CROSBIE or CORSBIE, from which the name may have been taken.Robert de CROSSEBI, of Oulcottes, born circa I339, and son of the above, was succeeded in the property by his son Richard, and grandson Robert, the latter of whom, dying in 1498, left two sons and a daughter.For the later genealogy of the family see Appendix D."
Appendix A Page 251
"NO. 45.-Edinburgh, 16 Dec. 1686.Forasmuch as the Kings most exellent Majestic by a letter direct under the Royal hand dated at Whitehall the 26th day of November last bypast, to the Privy Councill of this his ancient Kingdome, Resolved that the persons underwritten should be nominat and appointed Magistrats and other Councillors for the Burgh of Dumfreise, as being such whom hisMajestie judges most loyall and ready to promote his Royall Service and most forward to support the good and interest of the said Burgh.Therefore, the Lords of his Majesties Privy Councill inpursuance of his Majesties commands aforesaid Do hereby nominat
and appoint John Maxwell of Barncleugh to be Provost of the said Burgh of Dumfreise, John Irving, son to the deceased John Irving lait Provost there, to be baillie in place of baillie Fingass deceased, John Rome present baillie, and John Irving, present baillie, to continue bailies; John CORSBIE present Deacon of the Trades to be Conveiner, and the four new merchant councillors which are yearly elected with the Dean Treasurer and the rest of the Deacons of Trades, to be elected by the advice of the Magistrats aforesaid, All which persons are hereby authorised to continue in thair respective offices in the said Burgh and Liberties thereof untill Michallmasse nixt ensueing the date of these presents.And the saids Lords ordains the persons above named to meet at the Toun Councill House of the said Burgh of Dumfreise, upon the 11th day of January nixt, and there to enter to thair respective offices, according as is prescribedby his Majesties letter:And this present Act is extracted forth of the Records of the Privy Councill by me Sir William Patersone Knight, Clerk to his Majesties Privy Councill.
(Original in Burgh Charter Chest)."
Appendix D
CROSBIE OF OULCOTTIS AND HOLM
Robert Crosbie of Oulcottis 1415-98 son of Richard of Oulcottis
Robert had three children: Andrew 1433 d. by 1498,
Steven 1435 outlawed with Andrew [A.D.C. 420]
and Janet 1437 m. 1st Lord Carlisle as 2nd wife
Andrew's son = Robert Crosbie of Oulcottis b. 1481 succeeded his grandfather in 1498. In 1502 he sold the lands of Sark to Andrew Chalmer. In 1516 he sold Oucottis to William Lord Carlisle [Scots Peerage II 385.] m. Elizabeth dau. Of William 2nd Lord Carlisle.
Robert had two sons; Robert Crosbie 1513 d.s.p. 1563
and John Crosbie 1518 merchant bailie of Dumfries 1543. d. circa 1582. He is the FOUNDER of the Dumfries Branch of the family. m. Janet, sister of Provost Roger McBrair
John had two sons; Robert Crosbie 1550 m. Sophia Gledstanis
and John Crosbie, clerk in Holy Orders, Bishop in 1600 d. 1621 FOUNDER of the Irish Branch. Issue
Robert had five children; John Crosbie b. 1573 in Kelwod m. Agnes Dalrymple,
David Crosbie 1608 [merchant in Dumfries, Grandfather of William Crosbie, deacon coveener d.s.p. m. Maria Swan], two daughters, and Andrew Crosbie 1620 d. Aug 1674 m. Elizabeth Corrie dau. Of William Corrie. 2nd m. Helen Newall, d. 1675
Andrew had three children; John Crosbie 1650-1720, Provost of Dumfries, purchased Holm of Dalscairth in 1708 1st m Margaret dau. Of Robert Herries of Burnbarroch mother of Andrew Crosbie of Holm, 2nd m 4 Feb 1691 Janet dau. Of James Kennan bailie of Dumfries mother of Mary. Andrew's 2nd child a daughter named Agnes, and third, a son Andrew Crosbie, younger 1674, merchant, tenant of Thomas Gledstanis [R.P.C. II, 3rd, ser. 615]
From here on the chart becomes cluttered and hard to type out without drawing a bunch of connecting lines, so I have prepared a Gedcom file for anyone that wants it.
The recorded Crosby Family Shield was a gold cross on a red shield
The recorded Corsby Family Shield was a red cross on a gold shield